Viewport scale

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SoundFred
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Viewport scale

Post by SoundFred » Sat May 14, 2022 12:17 am

Hi
I Have been working with AutoCadd for 20+ years.
I switched to QCADPro ver 3.27.1 so I can work on my MacBook Pro OS 11.6
I'm having trouble getting Viewports scaled to fit an 11" x 17" page.
I've read through the forum and the user's manual and any toutorials I can find.
I've spent almost 30 hrs trying to plot some drawing I've created.

I have a paper space block created for an 11x17 page with a title block and border on it.
I select Draw-Viewport-Add viewport.
I set the value in the scale window
Then select the part of the drawing I want on that page.
Then choose which paper space layout to put it on.

Every time the drawing is far lager than the paper and border no matter what value I put in for the scale ie 1:100 or 100:1 or 1000:1 The scale at this point does not seem to change the size of the image in the viewport.
If I adjust the scale after it takes me to paper space the size of the pages changes but not my title block and border.

What am I missing?

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Husky
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by Husky » Sat May 14, 2022 1:54 am

Hi,

please attache the drawing or an example drawing what shows the same issue to your post and I'm sure we can find the solution in no time. Thanks.
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ryancousins
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by ryancousins » Sat May 14, 2022 2:23 am

Let's see if we can work this out!

If you can send the file, that would be helpful.

When you first set the value of the scale, I assume you're talking about the scale field that shows up in the model space right after you select "draw viewport"? If so, I'm surprised that it doesn't change the size of the geometry inside the viewport selection window. As a side note, once you select your viewport area and are sent back into the paper space to place the viewport on the paper, this scale field is the same as the one you should now see on the right-most side of the toolbar at the top of the app. The scale field on the left of the top toolbar will change the size of everything on the paper, so your title block would change also. Some people purposely create their title block x times larger or smaller based on what they will be scaling. For instance, if you knew you were going to scale down 1:10, some people would make their title block ten times larger than it should be so that it will scale down the proper size. I have never used that method.

Here is a link https://www.loom.com/share/e8ba2279cae3 ... 78f7443614 to a short video of me walking through similar steps. I created a "title block" that is 10 by 16 inches and placed it on my 11 by 17 inch paper. Next, I created a 60 by 60 inch square to be my main drawing object. My goal was to scale this down by a factor of ten so it becomes a 6 by 6 inch square on the paper. Right after I select "draw viewport", I enter a value of 1/10 in the scale field and you can see that this value carries over into the right-side field in the paper space and my 60" square indeed scales down to fit as expected on the paper.

Let me know if there is anything about your steps I am not understanding correctly and we can go from there.

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ryancousins
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by ryancousins » Sat May 14, 2022 2:32 am

Looks like Husky replied while I wandered away from my computer before finishing my response. I believe he uses the "scale up or down your title block to cancel out how much you have to scale up or down your viewport" method, (Did I get that right, Husky? :lol: ) so if he gets back to you first, it might be a different method than I use but he is a QCAD master so you'll be in good hands. :D

SoundFred
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by SoundFred » Sat May 14, 2022 5:11 am

Thanks for the reply Ryan
I don't have that second "scale box" on my tool bar.
Trying to figure out how to place it there.

In the mean time I read that one can use the " Property Editor" on the viewport.
I just started bringing in the viewport at the size it wants to be, grabing the corners and fitting them to my 11 x 17 page then scaling the contents using the Property Editor.
Kind of clunky but it is getting the job done before Monday.

Your video is real clear on how to so it with the second scale box on the tool bar.

Thanks so much for your help.

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Husky
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by Husky » Sat May 14, 2022 6:03 am

ryancousins wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 2:32 am
I believe he uses the "scale up or down your title block to cancel out how much you have to scale up or down your viewport" method, (Did I get that right, Husky? :lol: )
Nope - I wouldn't support that approach. :wink:
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SoundFred
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by SoundFred » Sat May 14, 2022 6:35 am

Glad to hear you don't support that idea.
I tried it a while ago and it is a very clunky way to get the task done.

I think I'll be fine as soon as I find that second " Scale box " on the tool bar.

Thanks

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Husky
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by Husky » Sat May 14, 2022 8:34 am

SoundFred wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 12:17 am
Every time the drawing is far lager than the paper and border no matter what value I put in for the scale ie 1:100 or 100:1 or 1000:1 The scale at this point does not seem to change the size of the image in the viewport.
If I adjust the scale after it takes me to paper space the size of the pages changes but not my title block and border.
What am I missing?
What you describe is an adjustment of the paper scale instead of the viewport scale!

SoundFred wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 12:17 am
I have a paper space block created for an 11x17 page with a title block and border on it.
1. I select Draw-Viewport-Add viewport.
2. I set the value in the scale window
3. Then select the part of the drawing I want on that page.
4. Then choose which paper space layout to put it on.
Please note: All this steps are correct ... but ...
Step 4 needs more of your attention. In the moment QCAD switches to paper_space it will automatically display two scales in the option bar. The left one is for the paper scale - the right one for the viewport scale. If you need for some reasons to change the viewport scale then you have to do that BEFORE you place the viewport in your paper_space. Reason: In the moment you place the viewport the viewport scale will vanish from the option bar! Only the paper scale remains ...

If you need to change the viewport scale after you placed it in paper_space you have to select the viewport and adjust the scale within the property editor. Certainly - this will work immediately or month later ... :wink:
I recommend to keep paper, title block, border etc etc in 1:1. Scale only the viewports as you need it in your print. Print it 1:1.
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Win10/64, QcadPro, QcadCam version: Current.
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SoundFred
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by SoundFred » Sat May 14, 2022 7:03 pm

Thanks for your time Husky.
Glad to have people like you who can explain things is simple straight forward terms.

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ryancousins
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by ryancousins » Mon May 16, 2022 2:40 pm

Husky,
Husky wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 6:03 am
ryancousins wrote:
Sat May 14, 2022 2:32 am
I believe he uses the "scale up or down your title block to cancel out how much you have to scale up or down your viewport" method, (Did I get that right, Husky? :lol: )
Nope - I wouldn't support that approach. :wink:

Here are some of the posts where you mentioned the "if you scale your viewport by 1:X, then you need to scale your title block by X:1 to compensate" that I suggested earlier in this thread that you are a proponent of. I'm not pointing these out to interrogate you but rather just to better understand your thinking because you are someone that knows the program and in general CAD very well and I want to make sure I didn't totally misunderstand all of this! :lol:

https://qcad.org/rsforum/viewtopic.php? ... ger#p18831
e.g. you will print your drawing in 1:50 then you have to insert the title block 50 times bigger ...

https://qcad.org/rsforum/viewtopic.php? ... ger#p15179
If you like to print it with a 1:10 scale you need to scale the title block (+drawing frame?) 10 times bigger ...

https://qcad.org/rsforum/viewtopic.php? ... ale#p31379
Keep in mind: If you intent to print with a scale of 1:10 then you have to compensate the Paper_Frame etc with a counter-scale factor of 10.

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andrew
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by andrew » Mon May 16, 2022 2:57 pm

Both approaches are perfectly valid. You can scale your whole drawing, including border, etc. or work with viewports and keep the borders and title block in paper space coordinates. Viewports are more flexible but also more complex.

Tutorial for the first approach without viewports:
https://www.qcad.org/en/tutorial-printing

Tutorial for the second approach with viewports:
https://www.qcad.org/en/tutorial-workin ... -viewports

SoundFred
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by SoundFred » Mon May 16, 2022 10:43 pm

Thanks for the help from all of you.
Once I found that viewport " scale box " everything became clear.

Thanks to Ribbonsoft for creating such a great little CAD program (that works on My Mac)
This does %90 + of what I spent years doing in AutoCadd.

Again Thanks.

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Husky
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by Husky » Tue May 17, 2022 12:49 am

Hi ryancousins,
ryancousins wrote:
Mon May 16, 2022 2:40 pm
I'm not pointing these out to interrogate ...
Ok, let the battle begin. No, I think it's legit to ask. :wink:

ryancousins wrote:
Mon May 16, 2022 2:40 pm
I want to make sure I didn't totally misunderstand all of this! :lol:
I don't think you misunderstand any of this but I think that you missed an important fact (Andrew has already mentioned that).

My answers reply to two different situation:
1. Printing out of Model_Space
2. Printing out of Paper_Space

If you check your Quotes of me again then you will figure that I answer to 1. with "Scale Title Block, Border etc" and to 2. don't "Scale Title Block, Border etc.
Both methods are absolute common practice in CAD and I wouldn’t judge which one is better. It depends always on the situation. However - a user who is asking for help refers most of the time to only one method and I try to stick to his initial question. In this particular case the user has ask for an answer to 2.

Sure - I could always explain both methods but I think that is more confusing than helpful. Sooner or later a user will figure that there are multiple approaches to solve a problem - no need to scare him/her away with the complexities of those task.

I try to life by the KISS principle. It works for me and It worked for my students (Professional Mechanical CAD Drafter).
https://www.wikiwand.com/en/KISS_principle
However - It will early enough become complicated. Just wait for it ... ;-)

Another important fact:
QCAD is growing fast (thanks to Andrew!) and it could be that an answer found in this forum is outdated respective to the current QCAD release. You quoted links from me which were written before the Viewport was in QCAD Pro implemented at the end of 2017 ... or so ...

On the other hand - I'm learning every day from user problems. From time to time it will change my own workflow to the better. It could be that I was convinced by something 2 years ago and now after learning a better way I recommend something else. Kind of a personal evolution ...
Work smart, not hard: QCad Pro
Win10/64, QcadPro, QcadCam version: Current.
If a thread is considered as "solved" please change the title of the first post to "[solved] Title..."

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ryancousins
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Re: Viewport scale

Post by ryancousins » Tue May 17, 2022 3:44 pm

Husky wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 12:49 am

I don't think you misunderstand any of this but I think that you missed an important fact (Andrew has already mentioned that).
I specialize in missing important facts!

You bring up many good thoughts, especially about not confusing people with multiple ways to solve a problem. That's something for me to be mindful of in the future. I have a habit of doing that more often than not.

I did my quick search and grabbed those quotes but I should have taken more time to make sure I remembered them the way I thought I did. :oops: I want to give back to the community by helping but I usually feel like I'm barely on the threshold of mastery enough to rightfully be offering my help so I try to think about what the more experienced users have offered as a related solution in the past. In this case I suppose poor memory glossed over it all just a little too much.

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